"The US spent $5 billion to overthrow Yanukovich, the duly elected leader of Ukraine. We caused this war, or at least set the chessboard in motion."
That is exactly correct. But even the assholes on Fox News are blaming Putin for starting the war. It is impossible to get anything on TV except warmongering bullshit.
whole US ruling class need to be thrown in the trash bin. Those people are over. This country's elite, this country's institutions are in complete failure. Trump was the only logical choice the people had.
1. Vance is the sane one. In fact, I would not be surprised if he set this up.
2. *If* Trump is serious, all he need do is cut off Starlink and other ELINT (satellite recon and AWACS being chief among these). Europe can cry and scream, but cannot readily replace them.
Military consequences vs political: the AFU might hold out 6 months or more without US money but their political system wouldn’t last six hours. Zelensky might be wise to go straight to exile in France and not return to Ukraine after this failure.
As much as I despise Zelensky, it was hard not to cringe on his behalf re.: this so-called "deal." What exactly Ukraine to be thankful for? Clearly, Ukrainians refuse to blame themselves for being naive/stupid/greedy to let the US lead them down the primrose path. I tried to explain to my Ukrainian friends in Ukraine, what to expect, they just couldn't believe me. Now, they got country in ruins, millions dead/displaced, future generations of Ukrainians to pay the US for the privilege of their predecessors fighting as the gladiators for the delusions of Empire? Thanks but no thanks. Ukraine knows now it's screwed and Ukrainians are vengeful people....
Let's not forget that Trump was weaponizing Ukraine during his own term. Instead of stopping whatever Obama was doing, Trump continued to weaponize Ukraine. I really don't like about Trump his inability to own his own mess, be it with Ukraine or Covid-19 vaccine "you're welcome, Joe."
To be fair, I think today that what prevented Trump from repeating his mistakes today was not any master plan or grand strategy on the part of Trump, but a good old-fashioned personality clash.
Expect the CIA to give all concerned a stern talking-to.
Russian TV said today that Trump extended sanctions against Russia for 1 more year. How exactly it helps anything at this particular time or promoting USD as "world currency" or at least not to being shunned? Sanctions must be banned as a method of "diplomacy."
Not really, it was a logical conclusion, since from the start Ukrainians were told that the US is with Ukraine to "defeat Russia on the battlefield," then "for as long and whatever it takes,' then " till the last Ukrainian," then "yes, but within the reason," then "you're not grateful enough," then "send your 18 yo in the trenches," then "hand over your rare earth minerals to us for posterity," now "seize the fire or else" - it was bound to produce an explosion of tempers, I just didn't expect it to be so public.
there has got to be something wrong with the man. And I fear eventually we will find out. But, maybe he hangs on until the Ohio Hillbilly takes over????
Zelensky's fantasy victory was always a lethal delusion.
I was amazed to hear a Ukrainian student here in Amsterdam in 2023 say: 'We will never stop until we have restored the 1991 borders!'
What? I asked... you think you can take back Crimea?
'Our constitution says independence for any region must be approved by a majority of all within the 1991 borders, and we will never give up, whatever it costs and however long ot takes.'
It's easy to be brave in Amsterdam when the war is in Ukraine. Eastern Ukraine is strongly pro-Russian and western Ukraine is strongly anti-Russian. Look for some separation between them for peace.
Thanks for your update. Hardly surprising. Zelensky is the spoiled child in dirty clothes causing intense feelings of dread when his parents are invited to a garden party and immediately ask if the Brat can accompany them. The hosts regret extending the invitation and all the flowers in the garden wilt.
Europe is irrelevant. They are talking about thirty thousand troops in a conflict zone with a half million troops. Thirty thousand is typically the number each side commits to one of their set piece engagements over a small in village in Ukraine. Meanwhile there is still the thousand mile battle front remaining.
I struggle to see how they could even manage 30,000. The French and british seem to be the only ones interested and they can barely deploy a brigade each.
Some good guesses. Trump could have had his "ducks" lined up better RE Zelensky. But he can now posture that Zelensky doesn't "want peace," stop whatever funding/weapons deliveries is scheduled, walk away and dump the war on the frazzled Euros. Without U.S. support, the Euro effort to continue backing Ukraine as Russia ramps up the tempo on the battlefield will fade. If Mr. Z doesn't get outta Dodge soon, he's a lot dumber than I think he is! A Rada Kingpin or some other
stand in (Zaluzhny, Poroshenko?) can embrace "neutrality" and save the country inking an agreement that ends the conflict on Russia's terms. Once ended and the Euros resigned to reality, then all parties can more easily pursue a bigger picture security architecture for the continent, etc.
You're right. But he was encouraged to consider himself a kind of world leader. No one significant has ever protested his arrogance, his insolence, and his lies. No one, until the current American administration.
The "photographic evidence" Zelensky brought with him- in the photoshop age? Really? He just can't get off the high horse, "whatever Ukraine says goes" as the ultimate truth.
Overall, I believe your reading of the events is spot on, Stephen.
I would only add that in my understanding, the point of this press conference
in Trump's and Vance's minds was not to set a trap for Zelensky, but only to show US media and citizens that the real issue was peace. Trump went a long way to express admiration for and sympathy to Ukrainians.
Zelensky felt he had to impose his perspective. He chose the wrong event to do so, it was a serious mistake to do it in front of cameras. He let the stakes get over his situational awareness.
Overall, I see this not as a trap or any form of foul play, as the European media are painting it, but as a big blunder.
I would stress the issue of intercultural communication, because it had a big part in the blunder. Zelensky's command of English is poor, and his understanding of American ways is as poor. Several time, Zelensky tried to make a point in clumsy English, but what Trump and Vance received was seriously different from what he intended to convey.
The major issue now, is what Europeans will want to do. The choice set by yesterday's event is between two possibilities: 1) causing a final break with the US to keep supporting Ukraine; or 2) letting Ukraine down to preserve the relationship with the US. Both outcomes are emotionally unconfortable to Europeans, and set an equally uncertain strategic future.
.
But I would question your conclusion that Ukraine will collapse quickly is the US withdraws all support, which I eblieve like you do will happen. Their is a 3rd option to be considered. The question on this issue, is how much Europeans can still do, and whether they'll choose to do it.
Europe cannot support Ukraine on her own without sacrificing her own long-term military power. Yet, she can support Ukraine. It is possible that France and some other countries will chose to drastically empty their domestic stocks to sustain the war without the US.
In my view, this would be a tragic choice. Because Europe isn't set to increase industrial production any time soon, which means that no matter how much they sacrifice of their own assets to help Ukraine, it will never be enough to bring victory, and it will only make the situation worse.
If that happens, I can foresee two possible outcomes on the mid-term: either Ukraine ends up more devastated, possibly annihilated, and Europe is humiliated and defeated for a long time; or Europe manages to bring industrial production to a reasonably useful level, in which case this might well turn into a major Europe-wide war. Again. As if history had taught us nothing.
Europe is possibly about to commit suicide for a third time. Out of being unable to eat their hats, and out of unwillingness to lose face over the bad choices of the last 3 years.
In any case, Trump will not let the US be drawn in European blunder. Either Europeans back away from the edge of the cliff and let Trump have his way to impose peace through Ukrainian defeat. Or the original US-made crime set by neocon ambitions in Ukraine will finally result in European destruction. But America will keep itself safe from consequences.
Trump was so angry that I can't imagine him going the extra mile to make it work with Zelensky. My immediate thought is that Zelensky is a dead man walking. Trump will roll him over at some point some way. Then there is the National Assembly. Will they be smart enough to approve a peace deal? Zelensky demonstrated his utter stupidity. Why did he come?! My prediction is Trump goes to war against Zelensky hard.
did you even read the article? Stephen was the one who brings it up in the 1st paragraph. "or for that matter show up in a tight fitting sweatshirt and slacks"
Musk wore a jacket at the cabinet meeting. During the meeting he opened the jacket to display the logo on the T-shirt underneath for a photo op. The logo identified him as tech support for the benefit of those who wonder what he was doing there. He wasn't wearing a two thousand dollar suit because that is what is suitable for members of such a formal type meeting. He was wearing formal attire more suited for the I.T support guy. And he doesn't wear t-shirts in the oval office.
he has worn that style outfit ever since the start of this war. Even when giving speeches at the UN, meeting with former President Biden, or other European heads of state. If he always wore a suit, but showed up to this meeting dressed like that, you'd have a point. But that's not the case
The US spent $5 billion to overthrow Yanukovich, the duly elected leader of Ukraine. We caused this war, or at least set the chessboard in motion.
"The US spent $5 billion to overthrow Yanukovich, the duly elected leader of Ukraine. We caused this war, or at least set the chessboard in motion."
That is exactly correct. But even the assholes on Fox News are blaming Putin for starting the war. It is impossible to get anything on TV except warmongering bullshit.
whole US ruling class need to be thrown in the trash bin. Those people are over. This country's elite, this country's institutions are in complete failure. Trump was the only logical choice the people had.
"Trump was the only logical choice the people had."
If you feel compelled to vote, that is true, but there is always the choice not to vote.
The CIA caused the Maidan revolution. Kiev started the war by abdicating from the Minsk agreements.
“What difference does it make?”
HRC
I have another guess: a freeze on the assets of Ukrainians who are suspected of embezzlement of US taxpayers’ money.
Including Biden's, McConnell's, and Graham's assets.
1. Vance is the sane one. In fact, I would not be surprised if he set this up.
2. *If* Trump is serious, all he need do is cut off Starlink and other ELINT (satellite recon and AWACS being chief among these). Europe can cry and scream, but cannot readily replace them.
Ukraine will have no choice but to give in.
Definitely, Vance is very impressive, and probably the best we got.
I really wish he becomes the next president. Thanks
Military consequences vs political: the AFU might hold out 6 months or more without US money but their political system wouldn’t last six hours. Zelensky might be wise to go straight to exile in France and not return to Ukraine after this failure.
As much as I despise Zelensky, it was hard not to cringe on his behalf re.: this so-called "deal." What exactly Ukraine to be thankful for? Clearly, Ukrainians refuse to blame themselves for being naive/stupid/greedy to let the US lead them down the primrose path. I tried to explain to my Ukrainian friends in Ukraine, what to expect, they just couldn't believe me. Now, they got country in ruins, millions dead/displaced, future generations of Ukrainians to pay the US for the privilege of their predecessors fighting as the gladiators for the delusions of Empire? Thanks but no thanks. Ukraine knows now it's screwed and Ukrainians are vengeful people....
And let’s not forget Trump is trying to stop a shit show that goes back to the Obama state Department/CIA over 10 years ago. This was not his screwup.
Let's not forget that Trump was weaponizing Ukraine during his own term. Instead of stopping whatever Obama was doing, Trump continued to weaponize Ukraine. I really don't like about Trump his inability to own his own mess, be it with Ukraine or Covid-19 vaccine "you're welcome, Joe."
Yes, Trump's first term was FUBAR. And it is certainly possible for him to do it again, but that was not what happened today.
To be fair, I think today that what prevented Trump from repeating his mistakes today was not any master plan or grand strategy on the part of Trump, but a good old-fashioned personality clash.
Expect the CIA to give all concerned a stern talking-to.
Russian TV said today that Trump extended sanctions against Russia for 1 more year. How exactly it helps anything at this particular time or promoting USD as "world currency" or at least not to being shunned? Sanctions must be banned as a method of "diplomacy."
My bet is that Z was on some sort of covaine downer or upper. But totally irrational from what I can see.
Not really, it was a logical conclusion, since from the start Ukrainians were told that the US is with Ukraine to "defeat Russia on the battlefield," then "for as long and whatever it takes,' then " till the last Ukrainian," then "yes, but within the reason," then "you're not grateful enough," then "send your 18 yo in the trenches," then "hand over your rare earth minerals to us for posterity," now "seize the fire or else" - it was bound to produce an explosion of tempers, I just didn't expect it to be so public.
there has got to be something wrong with the man. And I fear eventually we will find out. But, maybe he hangs on until the Ohio Hillbilly takes over????
"What exactly Ukraine to be thankful for?"
The killing, destruction, and territory lose stops with this deal. There is no path to victory for Ukraine.
Zelensky's fantasy victory was always a lethal delusion.
I was amazed to hear a Ukrainian student here in Amsterdam in 2023 say: 'We will never stop until we have restored the 1991 borders!'
What? I asked... you think you can take back Crimea?
'Our constitution says independence for any region must be approved by a majority of all within the 1991 borders, and we will never give up, whatever it costs and however long ot takes.'
He really seemed to believe what he was saying.
That is the problem.
'
It's easy to be brave in Amsterdam when the war is in Ukraine. Eastern Ukraine is strongly pro-Russian and western Ukraine is strongly anti-Russian. Look for some separation between them for peace.
...At the same time, I imagined Z on Friday at White House Pawnshop:
Sign here please...
'What are you offering for my national wealth?'
Never mind, we'll discuss that later. It will be good. Just sign.
'Er...'
Thanks for your update. Hardly surprising. Zelensky is the spoiled child in dirty clothes causing intense feelings of dread when his parents are invited to a garden party and immediately ask if the Brat can accompany them. The hosts regret extending the invitation and all the flowers in the garden wilt.
Europe is irrelevant. They are talking about thirty thousand troops in a conflict zone with a half million troops. Thirty thousand is typically the number each side commits to one of their set piece engagements over a small in village in Ukraine. Meanwhile there is still the thousand mile battle front remaining.
I struggle to see how they could even manage 30,000. The French and british seem to be the only ones interested and they can barely deploy a brigade each.
And with Britain it's a rather... light... brigade
We just may avoid WWIII. Good news for us and bad news for Zelensky.
Zelensky really won't care once he get to one of his mansions.
Some good guesses. Trump could have had his "ducks" lined up better RE Zelensky. But he can now posture that Zelensky doesn't "want peace," stop whatever funding/weapons deliveries is scheduled, walk away and dump the war on the frazzled Euros. Without U.S. support, the Euro effort to continue backing Ukraine as Russia ramps up the tempo on the battlefield will fade. If Mr. Z doesn't get outta Dodge soon, he's a lot dumber than I think he is! A Rada Kingpin or some other
stand in (Zaluzhny, Poroshenko?) can embrace "neutrality" and save the country inking an agreement that ends the conflict on Russia's terms. Once ended and the Euros resigned to reality, then all parties can more easily pursue a bigger picture security architecture for the continent, etc.
Ukraine may degenerate into civil war.
Ukraine might take it to the EU vs. internal. Ukraine got enough of "moles" already planted in the EU.
When was Zelensky ever a dignitary?
You're right. But he was encouraged to consider himself a kind of world leader. No one significant has ever protested his arrogance, his insolence, and his lies. No one, until the current American administration.
He can consider himself to be anything he wants but few are going to consider him to be a world leader when he has never dressed the part.
Expect "shocking evidence of latest Russian atrocity ZOMG" IN 5..4..3..2..1.
The "photographic evidence" Zelensky brought with him- in the photoshop age? Really? He just can't get off the high horse, "whatever Ukraine says goes" as the ultimate truth.
Doesn't matter, if people pretend to believe it.
Some pretend but some really believe.
Overall, I believe your reading of the events is spot on, Stephen.
I would only add that in my understanding, the point of this press conference
in Trump's and Vance's minds was not to set a trap for Zelensky, but only to show US media and citizens that the real issue was peace. Trump went a long way to express admiration for and sympathy to Ukrainians.
Zelensky felt he had to impose his perspective. He chose the wrong event to do so, it was a serious mistake to do it in front of cameras. He let the stakes get over his situational awareness.
Overall, I see this not as a trap or any form of foul play, as the European media are painting it, but as a big blunder.
I would stress the issue of intercultural communication, because it had a big part in the blunder. Zelensky's command of English is poor, and his understanding of American ways is as poor. Several time, Zelensky tried to make a point in clumsy English, but what Trump and Vance received was seriously different from what he intended to convey.
The major issue now, is what Europeans will want to do. The choice set by yesterday's event is between two possibilities: 1) causing a final break with the US to keep supporting Ukraine; or 2) letting Ukraine down to preserve the relationship with the US. Both outcomes are emotionally unconfortable to Europeans, and set an equally uncertain strategic future.
.
But I would question your conclusion that Ukraine will collapse quickly is the US withdraws all support, which I eblieve like you do will happen. Their is a 3rd option to be considered. The question on this issue, is how much Europeans can still do, and whether they'll choose to do it.
Europe cannot support Ukraine on her own without sacrificing her own long-term military power. Yet, she can support Ukraine. It is possible that France and some other countries will chose to drastically empty their domestic stocks to sustain the war without the US.
In my view, this would be a tragic choice. Because Europe isn't set to increase industrial production any time soon, which means that no matter how much they sacrifice of their own assets to help Ukraine, it will never be enough to bring victory, and it will only make the situation worse.
If that happens, I can foresee two possible outcomes on the mid-term: either Ukraine ends up more devastated, possibly annihilated, and Europe is humiliated and defeated for a long time; or Europe manages to bring industrial production to a reasonably useful level, in which case this might well turn into a major Europe-wide war. Again. As if history had taught us nothing.
Europe is possibly about to commit suicide for a third time. Out of being unable to eat their hats, and out of unwillingness to lose face over the bad choices of the last 3 years.
In any case, Trump will not let the US be drawn in European blunder. Either Europeans back away from the edge of the cliff and let Trump have his way to impose peace through Ukrainian defeat. Or the original US-made crime set by neocon ambitions in Ukraine will finally result in European destruction. But America will keep itself safe from consequences.
Trump was so angry that I can't imagine him going the extra mile to make it work with Zelensky. My immediate thought is that Zelensky is a dead man walking. Trump will roll him over at some point some way. Then there is the National Assembly. Will they be smart enough to approve a peace deal? Zelensky demonstrated his utter stupidity. Why did he come?! My prediction is Trump goes to war against Zelensky hard.
Has Trump placed a call to Hillary for some pointers on arkancide?
ROFLMAO
Truly wild day!
Thanks for your great work Stephen!
We've shared the link on our daily report.
A Skeptic War Reports
https://askeptic.substack.com/
I would never have predicted the Zelensky show!
but it's OK for Musk to be dressed like that in the Oval Office and Cabinet meeting?
Musk is not an official.
😂
You are more interested in fashion than in good governance?
Thank you.
did you even read the article? Stephen was the one who brings it up in the 1st paragraph. "or for that matter show up in a tight fitting sweatshirt and slacks"
So you follow his lead?
Musk wore a jacket at the cabinet meeting. During the meeting he opened the jacket to display the logo on the T-shirt underneath for a photo op. The logo identified him as tech support for the benefit of those who wonder what he was doing there. He wasn't wearing a two thousand dollar suit because that is what is suitable for members of such a formal type meeting. He was wearing formal attire more suited for the I.T support guy. And he doesn't wear t-shirts in the oval office.
yes, he did wear a tee in the oval during the Feb 11 news conf he had with Trump and his kid
Musk had a t-shirt with "TECH SUPPORT" on it under the coat, in the oval office.
He doesn't wear it to hide it.
Dress for success. Besides, this was a formal Heads of State visit.
he has worn that style outfit ever since the start of this war. Even when giving speeches at the UN, meeting with former President Biden, or other European heads of state. If he always wore a suit, but showed up to this meeting dressed like that, you'd have a point. But that's not the case